The new four from the freighter

[Barbecue_Bod]

Are we of the opinion that the events in the 'background' stories for these characters (pilot, ghost whisperer, anthropologist etc) happened 'after' they had been to the island or 'before'?

I think they are events happening after their visit to the island because of their weird reactions when hearing the news of Oceanic Flight 815 wreckage being found and the reaction of the anthropologist when she sees the dhama logo on the polar bears collar.

But of course these could be red herrings? There is nothing to definitely prove whether these events happened before or after they had been to the island. Is there?

[Ezekiel 25:17]

No, I think ur right. That there is no way Charlotte would have even known about Dharma until after she had been on the island, this is a good point. Maybe she is nice now, but becomes a bitch, when she gets power hungery like Ben did.

[hyperRevue]

No, I think ur right. That there is no way Charlotte would have even known about Dharma until after she had been on the island, this is a good point. Maybe she is nice now, but becomes a bitch, when she gets power hungery like Ben did.

It's totally possible, but it's also totally possible that Charlotte DID know about Dharma before going on this mission.

We just don't know nearly enough about her yet to say one way or the other.

[lilfrank]

I think that the side stories we are seeing of Miles, Dan, Charlotte and the pilot (Jeff?) are "flashbacks", while obviously the Oceanic 6 side stories are now "flash forwards". What is the pilots name?

[TuesdaySmith]

It really seems like they are flashbacks, not flashforwards.. The lawyer guy and Naomi are making the plans because "815" was found underwater. Daniel see's the wreckage on the news. How would it have happened after the island?

I think that Charlotte somehow found out about DHARMA and is trying to find out more about it. Kind of like someone obsessed with Atlantis or something.. "is it real?".

[hyperRevue]

It's also possible that they're a mix of forwards and backs. Charlotte could be a forward while Naomi's is clearly a back.

Just throwing that out there.

But I think they're all flashbacks.

[Barbecue_Bod]

but if they are flashbacks then why do they seem to be reacting strongly to the news of FLight 815 being found? For example, the way Daniel is crying when he sees the news? It is as if he has been on the island already and he is now off the island and is disturbed by this news because he knows something different - something terrible pehaps - or just that it is a lie that there were no survivors? Ah - but then again, perhaps it is a flash back because if it was happening in the future then how would they explain the 'Oceanic 6' survivors? Hope this makes sense?

[hyperRevue]

but if they are flashbacks then why do they seem to be reacting strongly to the news of FLight 815 being found? For example, the way Daniel is crying when he sees the news? It is as if he has been on the island already and he is now off the island and is disturbed by this news because he knows something different - something terrible pehaps - or just that it is a lie that there were no survivors? Ah - but then again, perhaps it is a flash back because if it was happening in the future then how would they explain the 'Oceanic 6' survivors? Hope this makes sense?

Both parts make sense by themselves and are completely mutually exclusive, haha.

But I think they can't be flashforwards because in the future The Oceanic 6 exists.

But it doesn't make sense that the Daniel and Miles aren't really surprised by the survivors.

[moneyshot]

yeah I was just thinking the same thing. I dont think these are flashbacks, I think they are flash fowards. and this is all happening after they have already been on the island

[hyperRevue]

yeah I was just thinking the same thing. I dont think these are flashbacks, I think they are flash fowards. and this is all happening after they have already been on the island

But the reports say there are no survivors.

How do you explain the Oceanic 6?

[TuesdaySmith]

How can they be flashforwards?

They were sent to the island by Matthew Abbadon. We don't know the purpose yet (it seems like it's for Ben), but we DO KNOW that Naomi asks him what happens if they run into survivors.

We also know that the pilot knows that Juliet wasn't on the plane and is "a native" because he memorized the manifest.

Daniel had a weird reaction, but he says "I don't know" when asked about it.

They all don't seem suprised that they run into survivors because they have a mission to look for people. AND Naomi seems to know the truth (that there are living survivors) hinting that she KNOWS that the 815 in the trench is just a cover-up. They had everything explained to them before they took the mission, so they have no reason to be suprised.

[Barbecue_Bod]

yes and i suppose they are not 'surprised' by the survivors when they get to the island becuase they have already had the news of these survivors while they are on the freighter due to the radio contact (and in last season did Naomi say something to them all about thinking there were no survivors when she first crash landed and was discovered by them)??

So I figure that we are seeing flashbacks for these characters before they went on the mission and not flashforwards.

[Barbecue_Bod]

Is it also significant that when the lawyer man is speaking to Naomi and briefing her on the mission to go to the island she says to him 'what if there are survivors'? and he states very clearly 'there were no survivors' - in a sort of 'get that in your head whether its true or not' type way. I mean is it significant that she was questioning whether there would be survivors?

Why would it concern her or why would she even question it? How would she be linking the crash of 815 with the island in the first place? Was the crash found so close to the island that people in the outside world would be theorising about the possibility of survivirs on the closest island? But did the news not state that ALL passenger had died? So why would she question that? Why say to the lawyer dude 'what if there are survivors'?
Her and her team on on a mission to get Ben (so it seems) so why is she making the connection with flight 815?
Is she concerned that they are going there to wipe out Ben and the others with gas, and doesnt want to harm innocents? But mainly I dont get why she would be connecting the crash - that had already been 'found' on the bottom of the ocen, with the island she was about to go to?

[moneyshot]

for instence the rescue team comes back before the oceanic 6. I believe the rescue team wants to kill ben, but they fail. and have to come back from there mission early

[luckyman_apd]

Are you people really this stupid? THEY ARE FLASHBACKS. They are flashing back to when these people see the wreckage being found. They could not go to the island and tell the survivors that the whole world thinks they are dead and the plane was found if they never saw the footage on TV. Think people. They know that plane is fake, and that the plane crashed on the island they are looking for. Come up with real questions like why Daniel(the physisit) is crying when he sees the wreckage on TV or how the second guy can talk to the dead? or who is Ben's informant on the boat. This is why this country is going to hell in a handbasket because nobody has processing skills anymore and noone can think 5 minutes past their face.

[Barbecue_Bod]

Hey luckyman_apd
it could also be going to 'hell in a handbasket' because people like you, do not have the 'processing skills' to join in a polite and friendly discussion without being so rude and confrontational?
PS these forums are used by people on a www, not just people from where you come from - the so called place where nobody has processing skills anymore and no one can think 5 minutes past their face.
thanks for reading :)

[thelawgiver]

Hello all. I'm new to this thread, but have a theory on this, so here it goes:

What if we are msiconstruing the use of the term "survivors"? I think Dharma figured out that there was some type of massacre on the island and that Ben was the culprit. So they send in a team in to get Ben. The team members have certain powers to deal with the weird science of the island. But when Naomi asks about survivors, she may be referencing Dharma massacre survivors and not 815 survivors!!

[polarsawyer]

Both parts make sense by themselves and are completely mutually exclusive, haha.

But I think they can't be flashforwards because in the future The Oceanic 6 exists.

But it doesn't make sense that the Daniel and Miles aren't really surprised by the survivors.

I think they are flashbacks. When asked by his wife, i am assuming, Daniel said he didn't know why he was upset. It was breaking news that the plane had be found. And THEN when they got to the island, Sayid was walking and talking with Miles and said " we are presumed dead back home, why are you not surprised to see us " so it HAD to have happend in the PAST.

They may have already been contacted by the Abaddon and Naomi for the mission before the news hit about the airplane

[aZiXx]

But the reports say there are no survivors.

How do you explain the Oceanic 6?

Thank you pointing that out.

These are likely flashbacks. Why? I would hope the Lost makers would stick with flashbacks or flashforwards in an episode. Flashbacks for the new guys to get a backstory and develop their characters personalities, and flashforwards for the Losties as seems to be the theme.

Charlotte, for me my theory is she knows of Dharma, she is working for an entity that knows of Dharma and they are interested in all things Dharma.

Miles, he's a ghost dude, and we see his past of being dishonest, and using his talents in not the best way (ie for collecting drug money)

Daniel, well I suppose he could be a very emotional and empathic shy guy, who feels for the loss of Oceanic 815 people and their families.

I really doubt these are flashforwards... just my opinion.

[Kage]

The pilots name is Frank Lapidus played by Jeff Fahey.

[polarsawyer]

Is it also significant that when the lawyer man is speaking to Naomi and briefing her on the mission to go to the island she says to him 'what if there are survivors'? and he states very clearly 'there were no survivors' - in a sort of 'get that in your head whether its true or not' type way. I mean is it significant that she was questioning whether there would be survivors?

Why would it concern her or why would she even question it? How would she be linking the crash of 815 with the island in the first place? Was the crash found so close to the island that people in the outside world would be theorising about the possibility of survivirs on the closest island? But did the news not state that ALL passenger had died? So why would she question that? Why say to the lawyer dude 'what if there are survivors'?
Her and her team on on a mission to get Ben (so it seems) so why is she making the connection with flight 815?
Is she concerned that they are going there to wipe out Ben and the others with gas, and doesnt want to harm innocents? But mainly I dont get why she would be connecting the crash - that had already been 'found' on the bottom of the ocen, with the island she was about to go to?


Don't get Abaddon (lawyer man) talking with Naomi and his time with Hurley mixed up on your timeline. I can see that you think its a flashforward because he was in Ep1 in the future. But the 4 new people, "frieghties", we recruited to get Ben. As in other Lost episodes, we see flashbacks for new people. I don't see this being any different. The show might try to confuse us and throw us off, but that wouldn't be a way I think they would do so.

All 4's primary mission is to get Ben. My assumptions for why they are on the island, or why the island brought them there are this:

Daniel, a physicist, I can only really imagine would be recruited to help identify things on the island. The electromagnetic occurances, and the energy produced by the island

Miles - he is there for his obvious sixth sense

Charlotte - palentoligist/anthropoligist- define as study of life/human/man. Maybe she is there to study the clones they were doing. or something along the lines of studying man.

Frank - he is the pilot, but also he was supposed to be flying 815 and the other guy took the flight for some reason unknown yet. He obviously should have been there in the first place. (we only found that out after a flashback when he called the hotline and said "i should have been flying the plane")

[mrstooge8it2]

maybe Frank is recruited because he was supposed to be flying 815 - so they had to get him back to the island so he could be killed

[Dzbabykel]

I agree Polarsawyer....I def think they were flashbacks because it was showing us how those 4 were recruited for the mission to the island. They gave us background information on each one and Matthew Abbadon was having Naomi get it set up. How could it be a flashforward if she was alive?? I know I know you all are probably saying well maybe she's still alive, but I just think thats rediculous. The writer's tell us over and OVER again that when people are pronounced dead on the show, they are in FACT dead. We've now been introduced to a ghost whisperer (lol) so we'll see where that goes. But yes, I agree they were def flashbacks.

[thelawgiver]

How can Miles speak to spirits without his portable vacuum cleaner! LOL