Was the picture always there?

[A.J. Hawk Fan]

The one that Christian showed Sun with a picture of Jin, Hurley, Jack and etc... Was it always there?

This is very confusing to me.

[Erratic Pendulum]

its possible but i doubt theres any other visible proof of it. id like to think it was.

[bunnydixon]

it reminded me of the shining.....

walt shines :p

[agmic]

The one that Christian showed Sun with a picture of Jin, Hurley, Jack and etc... Was it always there?

This is very confusing to me.

after it was taken in 1977, it was there....

[notsolost42]

I am sure it was always there but aside from when Ben and Roger Linus came to the island when else have we ever seen the processing center? I don't think we have because I think it will be destroyed in the next episode. We only have seen a small part of DIville as New Otherton. We have only seen the houses and the rec center. That's it. We never have seen the processing center in the "future" because it wasn't there. That's how TPTB are avoiding mass confusion and paradoxes about the losties in the past. I think that when we saw it last night it was the parallel universe.

[bunnydixon]

I am sure it was always there but aside from when Ben and Roger Linus came to the island when else have we ever seen the processing center? I don't think we have because I think it will be destroyed in the next episode. We only have seen a small part of DIville as New Otherton. We have only seen the houses and the rec center. That's it. We never have seen the processing center in the "future" because it wasn't there. That's how TPTB are avoiding mass confusion and paradoxes about the losties in the past. I think that when we saw it last night it was the parallel universe.

i think you and i are the only people having an issue with the processing centre lol!! they made too much of a point showing it, and yeah, ive never seen it whilst ben lived there. now i said it elsewhere but i'll say it again....perhaps sun and frank are not in 2007 OR something happened to create a different future. now i know there is the cant change the past argument but i think we can all agree that this probably means we cant change the definitive outcome and whilst the ghost town barracks may seem significant, it may well not be in the grand scheme of things.

[Newbie]

The one that Christian showed Sun with a picture of Jin, Hurley, Jack and etc... Was it always there?

This is very confusing to me.


The Photo is of ONLY the new recruits..thus ONLY Jack , Kate & Hurley
Sun never sees Jin in the photo

But I believe Yes it has always been there

[notsolost42]

i think you and i are the only people having an issue with the processing centre lol!! they made too much of a point showing it, and yeah, ive never seen it whilst ben lived there. now i said it elsewhere but i'll say it again....perhaps sun and frank are not in 2007 OR something happened to create a different future. now i know there is the cant change the past argument but i think we can all agree that this probably means we cant change the definitive outcome and whilst the ghost town barracks may seem significant, it may well not be in the grand scheme of things.

It's because there is a duality, two universes with two islands. Perhaps it was destroyed in one and not the other. Just because they are the same doesn't mean exactly the same. They can each take different paths to get to the same end. So, there you go. I am glad that someone here understands and agrees with me! It isn't too often! LOL!!!! Thanks Bunny!!!

[Missie]

i think you and i are the only people having an issue with the processing centre lol!! they made too much of a point showing it, and yeah, ive never seen it whilst ben lived there. now i said it elsewhere but i'll say it again....perhaps sun and frank are not in 2007 OR something happened to create a different future. now i know there is the cant change the past argument but i think we can all agree that this probably means we cant change the definitive outcome and whilst the ghost town barracks may seem significant, it may well not be in the grand scheme of things.

Maybe we never saw because we never looked for it. Besides there are prolly plenty of places in New Otherton that we have not seen yet. I think they made it a point to show the processing sign because they wanted us to get the connection that the losties were there getting thier assignments 30 years ago... or as Notso put it... in the paralel universe.

[Hume]

I thought it was a cool nod to King's The Shinning

[agmic]

In DIville, have we realy seen all of it???? last night, we saw some houses, which we've seen before, and the processing center, which before last night, we saw, ummmm once, way back with Ben and his dad. No other time have we seen that building. But what other buildings in DIville have we not seen yet ??????

[bunnydixon]

the only thing is.....

im not sure on the parallel universe idea. i do like that the 2 timelines are on the same tread but i dont think there is an alternate 2007, just this one that may have changed. now i know this brings up the whole paradox issue again but lets look at BTTF 2, they changed the future without creating a paradox. it was when the past was changed dramatically that caused issues. now i know some folks dont like to draw comparisons but sometimes it has got to be done ;)

yesterday i waffled some about time loops and said it would be against human nature as there is only so many times you will repeat something that doesnt work before trying something different? i think thats the case in this situation.

but im thinking on the spot and typing aloud...

but yes, i do understand exactly what you mean notso lol and this is just some of my slant on it.

[bunnydixon]

Maybe we never saw because we never looked for it. Besides there are prolly plenty of places in New Otherton that we have not seen yet. I think they made it a point to show the processing sign because they wanted us to get the connection that the losties were there getting thier assignments 30 years ago... or as Notso put it... in the paralel universe.

yeah, i already said to ort, it could be something as simple as that and the processing sign was just a familiar reference point!

but its still bugging me ;) lol!!!

[ortrules]

The processing center is not near the barracks - they are two different areas. The processing center is entered right off the docks from where new recruits get there by submarine. The barracks are no where near water - as seen in the first episode of season 3.

http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x01-cities/1/normal_twocitiescap-0088.jpg
http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x01-cities/1/normal_twocitiescap-0089.jpg

Additionally, Sun and Frank never walked through the sonar fence that surrounds the barrack area - so they can't be there.

[Missie]

In DIville, have we realy seen all of it???? last night, we saw some houses, which we've seen before, and the processing center, which before last night, we saw, ummmm once, way back with Ben and his dad. No other time have we seen that building. But what other buildings in DIville have we not seen yet ??????

Im sure there is plenty we havnt seen yet. We never saw the mechanics shop until recently either.

[Simon Blackrock]

not to get off topic here but the concept of duality is a very ancient egyptian concept. i believe called the maat or something,i am just remembering off the top of my head here.

now the pic must have been there!! like already said we had know way of seeing it.
but i brings up a question my girlfriend and i were going over last night.I said a while back ben wont be getting back to the island because he is already there.well it turned out he just couldnt go back to the dharma days,just like how charlottes body disapeared. is it because they are already there? wouldnt that debunk Miles is chengs son theory? and couldnt that mean Sun cant go there because she might be there as a kid? Paik industries is involved with the hanso group so it could be possible!

[notsolost42]

not to get off topic here but the concept of duality is a very ancient egyptian concept. i believe called the maat or something,i am just remembering off the top of my head here.

now the pic must have been there!! like already said we had know way of seeing it.
but i brings up a question my girlfriend and i were going over last night.I said a while back ben wont be getting back to the island because he is already there.well it turned out he just couldnt go back to the dharma days,just like how charlottes body disapeared. is it because they are already there? wouldnt that debunk Miles is chengs son theory? and couldnt that mean Sun cant go there because she might be there as a kid? Paik industries is involved with the hanso group so it could be possible!

Good point about Paik Industries. I think Mr. P was involved with Charles Widmore, built some of his ships or something according to the provenance. I think Sun is not there yet because of Jin for some reason. I usually don't just say things without some kind of back up so this is a rare exception. It is just a feeling. I am not sure if it's because she is on the island as a child or not. Another good point you made was about Miles. So, he is there. We know the baby is born in 1977. So they cannot be one in the same. Good catch. Who could the baby be then? He will definitly be someone we already know. I don't have a clue at this point but I agree, it is not Miles.

[bunnydixon]

The processing center is not near the barracks - they are two different areas. The processing center is entered right off the docks from where new recruits get there by submarine. The barracks are no where near water - as seen in the first episode of season 3.

http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x01-cities/1/normal_twocitiescap-0088.jpg
http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x01-cities/1/normal_twocitiescap-0089.jpg

Additionally, Sun and Frank never walked through the sonar fence that surrounds the barrack area - so they can't be there.

is the sonar a full circle?

also - in season 3 when jack and juliet are walked to the sub...they dont seem to have very far to go. they are collected from the barracks too. am i spying a continuity issue........and then we have miles in the boathouse, near water yet from that pic, there is no water for miles! hahaha - pardon the pun :p

[Missie]

Good point about Paik Industries. I think Mr. P was involved with Charles Widmore, built some of his ships or something according to the provenance. I think Sun is not there yet because of Jin for some reason. I usually don't just say things without some kind of back up so this is a rare exception. It is just a feeling. I am not sure if it's because she is on the island as a child or not. Another good point you made was about Miles. So, he is there. We know the baby is born in 1977. So they cannot be one in the same. Good catch. Who could the baby be then? He will definitly be someone we already know. I don't have a clue at this point but I agree, it is not Miles.

I still think its Miles. His nose started bleeding shortly after charlottes meaning out of all the Losties he had the second longest exposure to the island. (Would it be the longest exposure or the first one to be exposed chrologically? Either way, this puts Miles on the island prior to his frieghter days.)

[Simon Blackrock]

they are messing with our theories!!
the nose bleeds is an issue. i dont know.

[InTheBeginning]

The Photo is of ONLY the new recruits..thus ONLY Jack , Kate & Hurley
Sun never sees Jin in the photo
Thank you...this was bugging me last night. When Christian shows the picture to Sun, we all think that just because Sun sees Jack, Hurley, etc...she will assume that Jin is also there (at that time) Christian tried to clue her and Frank in when he said they have <a long journey> ahead.

The processing center is entered right off the docks from where new recruits get there by submarine. The barracks are no where near water - as seen in the first episode of season 3.
Thank you. That's what I thought as well. They walked right off the dock to the processing station, right?


Additionally, Sun and Frank never walked through the sonar fence that surrounds the barrack area - so they can't be there.
Does the sonar fence have to protect the water side of the island? Maybe the fence starts at the shoreline a ways down the beach on either side of the compound?

[Missie]

The processing center is not near the barracks - they are two different areas. The processing center is entered right off the docks from where new recruits get there by submarine. The barracks are no where near water - as seen in the first episode of season 3.

http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x01-cities/1/normal_twocitiescap-0088.jpg
http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-caps/season3/3x01-cities/1/normal_twocitiescap-0089.jpg

Additionally, Sun and Frank never walked through the sonar fence that surrounds the barrack area - so they can't be there.

I think we need a drawn out Island map. Like in "Lord of The Rings":p

[LissaMarie]

I think the Processing Center has been seen before. Remeber when Sayid took Miles to Otherton in order to exhange him for Charlotte? They threw Sayid in the room with Ben and later Locke came to speak with Sayid and offered him some lemonade. I think that was the Processing Center. I also believe that Ben had locked Kate in that same room as well. Am I right or is that a different place all together?

[Missie]

I think the Processing Center has been seen before. Remeber when Sayid took Miles to Otherton in order to exhange him for Charlotte? They threw Sayid in the room with Ben and later Locke came to speak with Sayid and offered him some lemonade. I think that was the Processing Center. I also believe that Ben had locked Kate in that same room as well. Am I right or is that a different place all together?

I think that was the rec center... but I cant be sure.

[LissaMarie]

Yes. My bad! And it was iced tea...not lemonade. Getting old sucks!!:P

[ortrules]

is the sonar a full circle?

also - in season 3 when jack and juliet are walked to the sub...they dont seem to have very far to go. they are collected from the barracks too. am i spying a continuity issue........and then we have miles in the boathouse, near water yet from that pic, there is no water for miles! hahaha - pardon the pun :p

Mikhail (I think) told us that the sonar fence surrounds the barracks.

Your second point is correct. I guess we just have to believe that there are multiple Dharma towns across the island and we've only seen one or two of them.

[bunnydixon]

surrounds yes, on land ;) what if they are close to water, making it not a full circle around?

[ortrules]

surrounds yes, on land ;) what if they are close to water, making it not a full circle around?

Maybe. But I think we can definitely say with certainty that there are multiple villages across the island. Apparently one is close to water. One is in the middle of the island. One is on the other island near the Hydra station.

[addictedtopainmeds]

The one that Christian showed Sun with a picture of Jin, Hurley, Jack and etc... Was it always there?

This is very confusing to me.

i think the more important question is how did christian know it was there in the first place?


christian='77 jack/ jacob=our jack

[Chronos]

The Photo is of ONLY the new recruits..thus ONLY Jack , Kate & Hurley
Sun never sees Jin in the photo

But I believe Yes it has always been there

True, Jin is not in the photo... but, Sun was travelling with Jack, Kate & Hurley and when Christian tells her she has a bit of a journey ahead of her he implies that they are with Jin.

[Jeremy]

I think the picture was "always" there, as the past hasn't been changed.

I think that there's enough evidense to support the idea that if they never went back in time, things wouldn't have happened to get them to the point where they would go back in time in the first place; Richard would have never known about Locke if he hadn't been visited by him in 1954, thus Locke would never end up on the island. If Jin didn't stop Rousseau from going in smokie's pit, she may not have been around 16 years later, so Alex wouldn't be able to help either Claire or Sawyer and Kate escape the Others.

[Chronos]

i think you and i are the only people having an issue with the processing centre lol!! they made too much of a point showing it, and yeah, ive never seen it whilst ben lived there. now i said it elsewhere but i'll say it again....perhaps sun and frank are not in 2007 OR something happened to create a different future. now i know there is the cant change the past argument but i think we can all agree that this probably means we cant change the definitive outcome and whilst the ghost town barracks may seem significant, it may well not be in the grand scheme of things.

I too am beginning to think that Lost is delving into multiple realities ideas. The evidence that surfaced last night being the Ajira 316 crew hearing the Numbers transmission from the island. Prior to this, we knew that Rousseau had replaced the numbers transmission with her own and that subsequently that transmission had been disabled.

Last night also told us that 1977 was "30 Years Earlier", which means that Ajira 316 occured (as we know) in 2007.

Evidently, the Losties travelling to the 1970's has changed things. I do not believe that the picture was always there. The current objective, thus, may be that they need to get back to their own reality.

[Chronos]

I think that there's enough evidense to support the idea that if they never went back in time, things wouldn't have happened to get them to the point where they would go back in time in the first place; Richard would have never known about Locke if he hadn't been visited by him in 1954, thus Locke would never end up on the island. If Jin didn't stop Rousseau from going in smokie's pit, she may not have been around 16 years later, so Alex wouldn't be able to help either Claire or Sawyer and Kate escape the Others.

True, these things you mention had an effect on the timeline. However, we should also consider that Locke talking to Richard and Jin saving Rousseau were fleeting, quick events. Currently, Sawyer & Co have been with Dharma for 3 years, which is quite a bit of time in comparison... Enough time to have some kind of effect in the timeline.

I think the timeline has changed. The Numbers transmission that we heard is not supposed to be there in 2007, it thus follows that the picture is not supposed to be there either.

[ortrules]

I too am beginning to think that Lost is delving into multiple realities ideas. The evidence that surfaced last night being the Ajira 316 crew hearing the Numbers transmission from the island. Prior to this, we knew that Rousseau had replaced the numbers transmission with her own and that subsequently that transmission had been disabled.

Maybe one of the Others simply fixed the transmission so it continued to repeat the numbers again. It has been 3 years since the O'6 left, I'm sure a lot has changed in that time. So I don't think it's evidence on anything.

[Chronos]

It's because there is a duality, two universes with two islands. Perhaps it was destroyed in one and not the other. Just because they are the same doesn't mean exactly the same. They can each take different paths to get to the same end. So, there you go. I am glad that someone here understands and agrees with me! It isn't too often! LOL!!!! Thanks Bunny!!!

I'm beginning to lean with you on this duality idea... and honestly, I like it... it means there is some great story-telling stuff coming.

Could it be possible that "The War" that is coming is between the two universes? This would make it of the apocalyptic scale that everyone seems to be afraid of. Ajira 316's presence in a modified island may signal that the "bad" reality is winning... and in that Humanity will be exterminated. We know that Ocean 815's crash was due to Desmond not entering the numbers in a timely fashion... so, perhaps that crash was not supposed to happen... once it did, it precipitated the events that the DI was trying to find out how to prevent... modifying the numbers to prevent the end of mankind.

Thinking outloud here

[Chronos]

Maybe one of the Others simply fixed the transmission so it continued to repeat the numbers again. It has been 3 years since the O'6 left, I'm sure a lot has changed in that time. So I don't think it's evidence on anything.

Hmmmmmm... okay, I'll grant you that.... Hurley's transmission of the numbers. If they did, it begs the question: why didn't they turn off Rousseau's transmission for 16 years? What's different now in the last 3 years? One thing is: the Losties being in the 70's.

Too bad we haven't heard the original transmission that Rousseau and her crew heard.

[ortrules]

Hmmmmmm... okay, I'll grant you that.... Hurley's transmission of the numbers. If they did, it begs the question: why didn't they turn off Rousseau's transmission for 16 years? What's different now in the last 3 years? One thing is: the Losties being in the 70's.

Too bad we haven't heard the original transmission that Rousseau and her crew heard.

Maybe they just left the transmission running because they knew they had the radio jamming to stop it from getting out. But now that the jamming station is out, they put the numbers back up?

Not sure.

[Workman]

I thought it was a cool nod to King's The Shinning

Yeah, it would've been funny if they put Nicholson's psycho smiling face in the picture.