Great episode for Kate

[Jakk]

Kate’s story is starting to grow on me. She started out as a “Mary Sue” character but for some reason the writers have given her a more human story arch. The loss of a child is no small thing and Evangeline seems to be playing the part very well. Kate seems to be a woman on a mission.


When she told Jack that not everything on the island was bad I could see her inner struggle with losing him. In the past Jack would have moved mountains for Kate but now she finally came to the realization that he is letting her go.

[Dude...What?]

All I know is that she plays the 3rd wheel on Juliet/Sawyer love affair very well. Sawyer cant shake her, and Juliet hates her for getting in the way.

[boutte]

Poor Kate. She really is a tragic figure. She killed her step-father because she loved her. Then Mom turns her back on her. The Australian farmer betrays her other lover dies trying help her escape. Then she falls for two guys and is conflicted over whom to chose only to be rejected by both. At this point her her best hope is to take the sub back to the States and live out her life from 1977.

[New Age Messiah]

Kate seems to be a woman on a mission.I don't think so. She's LOST.When she told Jack that not everything on the island was bad I could see her inner struggle with losing him.I don't think so. She isn't about losing or having anyone. She's deeply sensitive to the things people reveal abut themselves, that maybe they aren't aware of, like Jack had no idea that he was being completely dismissive of Kate, when he revealed his truest wish was for all of it to never have happened. That bummed her out. Not that she would lose him, but that he was never worth "having" in the first place.

[JohnQ]

I thought Kate went back to the island to find Claire as her mission.

[tpbaxter]

I don't think so. She's LOST.I don't think so. She isn't about losing or having anyone. She's deeply sensitive to the things people reveal abut themselves, that maybe they aren't aware of, like Jack had no idea that he was being completely dismissive of Kate, when he revealed his truest wish was for all of it to never have happened. That bummed her out. Not that she would lose him, but that he was never worth "having" in the first place.

nice insight Messiah. i agree with that.

[New Age Messiah]

In Jack's defense, Kate did sleep with Sawyer, and do his bidding, so she's got no one to blame but herself, if she did want Jack.

[tpbaxter]

In Jack's defense, Kate did sleep with Sawyer, and do his bidding, so she's got no one to blame but herself, if she did want Jack.

yeah, I think Jack had a similar moment when he said to Kate 'you didn't really like the old me either' ?

I don't know. I've never really felt like I was feeling the tension between Jack and Kate the way I think they wanted me to. But I did like the painful parts for some reason. Like that scene when Sawyer and Juliet were telling each other i love you in the sub. it felt so corny and fake but it was much better when Kate came in and you got that 'look' from Sawyer as he saw Kate coming down the ladder.

Maybe it's just me, but Lost doesn't seem to do love so well, but they do excel at tragedy.

by the way, I said something like this more concisely in another thread yesterday, but that post was deleted for reasons that are becoming increasingly annoying to me. * end tantrum *

[R.I.P.Charlie]

Jack has to fix things, thats his nature. He thinks its for the better that none of this ever happened. It boggles my mind that anyone of these people think they can change the past blowing up a bomb. It will just create a new time line. A new reality, one that doesnt guarantee anything

[rock-lobster]

Kate's always been an annoying character to me. Well, I do enjoy the acting by Lilly and i do enjoy the "character" as part of the show, but she's always been the one, IMO, who's been annoying to me.

like, she gets mad at jack for not caring enough about her, even though she slept with sawyer and probably would again if sawyer wasn't with juliet. it's pretty obvious to kate that when she finds out sawyer's taken she's pretty pissed/sad. and then when jack seems to put saving 48 people and such over them being an item, she feels the same way. pretty obviously, she's just being selfish. she wants BOTH of them to be in love with her, and she wants to do whatever she chooses to. she's very similar to another woman i know in that regard. kate wants to have her cake and another cake too.

she puts a baby (aaron) into harm's way just so she can have someone to look after. she knows that people are out to get the O6 and she makes matters worse by trying to act like aaron is her son.

she kills her stepfather because she hates him, despite the fact that her own mother defends him. it's not hers to decide who her mother is with, but she makes it hers. and she refuses to be tried for her act of selfishness. and then she still tries to get her mother to forgive her and become part of her life again.

she uses several people to get to a little toy plane, and then shoots them.

she kills her friend by being selfish. she wants him to get out of the car, she says no, and instead of accepting that she needs to sacrifice her freedom as to not involve him in the whole ordeal, she violently drives away and gets him killed.

she marries a guy who she doesn't tell her real name, who is a cop, at the risk of him getting booted from the force from it, and when she fears getting busted she drugs him and leaves him.

when the australian farmer tries to turn her in, the same australian farmer who kept her going for quite a while, she puts his life in danger, violently turning the car to avoid getting locked up. it doesn't kill him, but hell if it almost does.

and with ol' eddie mars, she tries to make sure he dies to prevent him from informing the island express that she's a murderer.

she wouldn't just kiss a guy to potentially save a girl's life. (the whole shannon inhaler thing)

it's kate's idea for sun to poison jin enough to get him off the raft, so that kate can nab that spot and get off the island.

when the losties in season 2 go to try and find michael, and are subsequently invited to tea and threats with bearded-tom, jack tells her she can't come. it's pretty obvious that the recently occurring things with her and sawyer, and with her and jack hooking up in the jungle, and other weird things happening to her at the time, that she's not mentally fit to run such an errand. she wanted to go though, so she ignored the prohibition and went on behind them. she winds up ruining any chance they had of getting michael back when they use her as a hostage to get them to lay their guns down and go back to the beach.

there's probably more i can't think of at the moment, it's been a long day. :D

it's just seriously obvious to me that kate's a selfish individual whether she does it consciously or not.

i don't like who she is (if i knew her in the real world, i'd stay the hell away), but i do like who she is in the way it adds to the show. but, i wouldn't call her a "tragic figure" or anything like that.

YMMV.

[tpbaxter]

Kate's always been an annoying character to me. Well, I do enjoy the acting by Lilly and i do enjoy the "character" as part of the show, but she's always been the one, IMO, who's been annoying to me.

like, she gets mad at jack for not caring enough about her, even though she slept with sawyer and probably would again if sawyer wasn't with juliet. it's pretty obvious to kate that when she finds out sawyer's taken she's pretty pissed/sad. and then when jack seems to put saving 48 people and such over them being an item, she feels the same way. pretty obviously, she's just being selfish. she wants BOTH of them to be in love with her, and she wants to do whatever she chooses to. she's very similar to another woman i know in that regard. kate wants to have her cake and another cake too.

she puts a baby (aaron) into harm's way just so she can have someone to look after. she knows that people are out to get the O6 and she makes matters worse by trying to act like aaron is her son.

she kills her stepfather because she hates him, despite the fact that her own mother defends him. it's not hers to decide who her mother is with, but she makes it hers. and she refuses to be tried for her act of selfishness. and then she still tries to get her mother to forgive her and become part of her life again.

she uses several people to get to a little toy plane, and then shoots them.

she kills her friend by being selfish. she wants him to get out of the car, she says no, and instead of accepting that she needs to sacrifice her freedom as to not involve him in the whole ordeal, she violently drives away and gets him killed.

she marries a guy who she doesn't tell her real name, who is a cop, at the risk of him getting booted from the force from it, and when she fears getting busted she drugs him and leaves him.

when the australian farmer tries to turn her in, the same australian farmer who kept her going for quite a while, she puts his life in danger, violently turning the car to avoid getting locked up. it doesn't kill him, but hell if it almost does.

and with ol' eddie mars, she tries to make sure he dies to prevent him from informing the island express that she's a murderer.

she wouldn't just kiss a guy to potentially save a girl's life. (the whole shannon inhaler thing)

it's kate's idea for sun to poison jin enough to get him off the raft, so that kate can nab that spot and get off the island.

when the losties in season 2 go to try and find michael, and are subsequently invited to tea and threats with bearded-tom, jack tells her she can't come. it's pretty obvious that the recently occurring things with her and sawyer, and with her and jack hooking up in the jungle, and other weird things happening to her at the time, that she's not mentally fit to run such an errand. she wanted to go though, so she ignored the prohibition and went on behind them. she winds up ruining any chance they had of getting michael back when they use her as a hostage to get them to lay their guns down and go back to the beach.

there's probably more i can't think of at the moment, it's been a long day. :D

it's just seriously obvious to me that kate's a selfish individual whether she does it consciously or not.

i don't like who she is (if i knew her in the real world, i'd stay the hell away), but i do like who she is in the way it adds to the show. but, i wouldn't call her a "tragic figure" or anything like that.

YMMV.

wow. you have convinced me. Kate is definitely FULL OF IT!

[rock-lobster]

wow. you have convinced me. Kate is definitely FULL OF IT!

if sincere: :)

if sarcastic: :D we all got our opinions.

[tpbaxter]

if sincere: :)

if sarcastic: :D we all got our opinions.

no sorry i really agree with you. there's nothing to disagree with. you have a laundry list of facts. she did do all the things you said. she is FOI.

[New Age Messiah]

Kate & Sawyer are soul mates. They both got the, do me now I'm hot thing. Screw society. They'll end up together, probably.

[tpbaxter]

Kate & Sawyer are soul mates. They both got the, do me now I'm hot thing. Screw society. They'll end up together, probably.

eh.. I don't know right now I'm not that crazy about Juliet's acting. I saw there's another thread going on somewhere about that strange blank stare she seems to have. If you ask me she has that 'I have kids and a family at home, what the hell am I doing talking about monsters? And you want me to say what about time travel now?' thing going on.

[New Age Messiah]

I'm not that crazy about Juliet's acting.Are you LOST? This is the Kate thread.

[tpbaxter]

oh yeah, i thought you said juliet and sawyer are soul mates. :o

what i said about juliet still stands though.

[rock-lobster]

no sorry i really agree with you. there's nothing to disagree with. you have a laundry list of facts. she did do all the things you said. she is FOI.

:) it honestly never dawned on me until just now when i was thinking, meh, i have mixed opinions of kate and here's why. after i actually wrote out most of the things she's done, i had to go back and edit my "mixed opinions" statement to a confession that i really dislike who she is. just watching her, she seems like such a sweet, sad and very unsure girl. but she's more of a terrible person than most of the other losties.

sayid tortured many people throughout his time but it's insanely obvious that he's truly remorseful for that. kate just seems to say, "well, you gotta understand, so and so..." and keep on doing bad things.

we see ben cause his non-genetic daughter's death, even though he never truly meant for it to happen. and we considered him pretty terrible for that.

kate killed her dad. on purpose. i mean, ben accidentally caused his daughter's death. kate... she just... blew the dude up.

[tpbaxter]

:) it honestly never dawned on me until just now when i was thinking, meh, i have mixed opinions of kate and here's why. after i actually wrote out most of the things she's done, i had to go back and edit my "mixed opinions" statement to a confession that i really dislike who she is. just watching her, she seems like such a sweet, sad and very unsure girl. but she's more of a terrible person than most of the other losties.

sayid tortured many people throughout his time but it's insanely obvious that he's truly remorseful for that. kate just seems to say, "well, you gotta understand, so and so..." and keep on doing bad things.

we see ben cause his non-genetic daughter's death, even though he never truly meant for it to happen. and we considered him pretty terrible for that.

kate killed her dad. on purpose. i mean, ben accidentally caused his daughter's death. kate... she just... blew the dude up.

totally agree. she needs to repent lest the smoke monster comes and thrashes her too but not before appearing as the talking horse Mr. Ed and convincing her to lead John Locke in circles. you know, like Eko and Yemi... except she sees horses... and Mr. Ed is a famous horse... who talks... nevermind!

[New Age Messiah]

she needs to repent lest the smoke monster comes and thrashes her tooI predicted on the prediciton thread that Smokie would get Kate, and when she was bolting the group, I thought, no way, really, was I right? She's a bitch. Sawyer's an ass, they belong together.

[Pung]

speaking of Sayid....how did he not slap Kate around after she said that she took little Ben to the others to be saved? It seemed in that conversation, they let her throw a little fit and then walk off. I dont like it. The conversation just seemed so written to me, if that makes sense.

[Dead but Here]

Kate is a psycho *****. She always was. She is immature... childishly egocentric. Kate is one of those dufus types who keeps going "Why do bad things happen to me?" and can't see it's because they keep doing stupid stuff. She has no handle at all on her emotions and impulses. She means well, but she's still just not a good person. I think the part about it being wrong to go around shooting little kids is the first thing she's really been right about.

Sawyer acts like an ass for a reason. He's probably the most emotionally fragile one of the whole bunch. Go back and watch him in season 1. He shoots off his mouth to keep people at a distance. He makes them judge him for things that aren't true so they never even learn about the things that are. And when he does something decent, (which is often) he does it in a way that keeps everyone mad at him anyway. .... And watch the scene where he was going to tell Kate Jack was trapped in the cave. She hurt his feelings. She does that a lot. (That would be because she's immature) Kate is so so so bad for him. I'm glad they let him grow up and find some peace and stability.

[Jakk]

Ok, so she killed a few people….:rolleyes:

IMO Kate has grown since the beginning of the show.

If you cherry picked anyone’s faults you’d be able to condemn everyone on the show. To be fair many on the island are culpable for all sorts of crimes. No matter what light you place her in Kate does love Aaron and he knows her to be his mom. Did she do that right thing by taking him as her own? Probably not but then again love makes people do strange things. As of now Kate is trying to do the right thing by looking for his “real” mother. This to me is probably the greatest sacrifice any on the island could make.

As far as Jack goes I think she has treated him wrongly. But he is not totally innocent. Kate is a typical girl who needs saving and Jack needs to save someone. This is almost always a disaster in the making. But it’s been three years. A life time of growth could happen in even less time.