Vincent is NOT Jacob.
However, Vincent is special because he is a dog.
More precisely he is an animal.
Its obvious that Vincent is special (thats why we want to attribute him to Jacob); however, the real reason is a fundamental clue to the whole show. Why?
Because ---Lost is about human philosophy-like it or not. Philosophy only applies to Human beings because we have "conscious" and are capable of rational thought, concepts of sin and guilt, and of learning without being taught on our own. Animals, on the other hand, use instinct. Minus instinct we can modify behavoir of animals by applying a stimuli but what animals learn is simply a basic response to stimuli. The only animal that has approached innovative new thought are apes.
So, basically, everything we have seen going on the island does NOT affect Vincent.
Thats why he is so special and thats why TPTB have assured us he will remain after the show. He is the real constant. He can't time travel....he has no concept of time for that matter. He exists in ALL timelines at once. So when we see him in 1977...he hasn't gone anywhere. He was always there. And, when we see him again, he never left.
__________________ "We set up this thematic debate between faith and empiricism, basically, in many different iterations of the show, that is what our story has been about"Carlton Cuse (1:00)
"Are conscious" or "have a conscience?"
I think dogs are conscious, they are aware of themselves.
And I think that a conscience comes from taught behavior.
If you lock a person in a closet from the time they're born... they will have no idea of 'right and wrong.'
Better yet, there are people out there who have done some pretty bad things, and feel less guilty about it, than a dog who pisses on the carpet.
__________________
... but that's not important right now.
My dog barks at herself in the mirror and freaks out. She thinks it's another dog. Even if she spots her reflection from under the bed so goes ballistic! She has no sense of autonomy whatsoever, whereas the cat I had would look at herself quite approvingly and preen. Truly hysterical.
My dog barks at herself in the mirror and freaks out. She thinks it's another dog.
Vincent = Jacob
Yes, instinct. Desire to protect and fight and ward off other animals who could be attacking the pack.
Hurley Bird = Jacob
__________________ "We set up this thematic debate between faith and empiricism, basically, in many different iterations of the show, that is what our story has been about"Carlton Cuse (1:00)
Yes, instinct. Desire to protect and fight and ward off other animals who could be attacking the pack.
Hurley Bird = Jacob
No, stupidity because she is afraid of other dogs. She hides under the bed and barks, hardly what I would call instinctual behaviour to protect the pack!
But, it is sooo damned cute and soooo funny!
"Are conscious" or "have a conscience?"
I think dogs are conscious, they are aware of themselves.
And I think that a conscience comes from taught behavior.
If you lock a person in a closet from the time they're born... they will have no idea of 'right and wrong.'
Better yet, there are people out there who have done some pretty bad things, and feel less guilty about it, than a dog who pisses on the carpet.
Yes, conscience...sorry.
A puppy that pisses on the carpet has no guilt at all.
A dog thats been "potty trained"...in other words -- taught that peeing on the carpet will lead to discipline, will lead to withholding love, could lead to the alpha dog and not getting thrown out of the heard/pack. Thats not guilt your seeing. What your seeing is their instinct to please the alpha dog and some fear that not doing that could led to them being put out on their own. In fact, thats the best training for potty training dogs. You don't have to spank them. Yell (bark loudy) at them and then immeidiately put them outside. The more cold it is outside and without food and water...the quicker they will realize that this behavoir could get them kicked out of the pack.
Funny thing is...try this behavoir with a cat and it has little effect. Cats have very little instinct for a herd or a pack-mentality. They just sort of think your insane. Cats on the other hand, have an instinct for self-cleaning and staying clean and even hiding their defecation. So for cats all you really need is a box of sand thats very clean (no odor)...their instinct takes over from there.
So I'm saying its instinct, and reaction to action, not guilt, not independent thought your seeing.
__________________ "We set up this thematic debate between faith and empiricism, basically, in many different iterations of the show, that is what our story has been about"Carlton Cuse (1:00)
A puppy that pisses on the carpet has no guilt at all.
A dog thats been "potty trained"...in other words -- taught that peeing on the carpet will lead to discipline, will lead to withholding love, could lead to the alpha dog and not getting thrown out of the heard/pack. Thats not guilt your seeing. What your seeing is their instinct to please the alpha dog and some fear that not doing that could led to them being put out on their own. In fact, thats the best training for potty training dogs. You don't have to spank them. Yell (bark loudy) at them and then immeidiately put them outside. The more cold it is outside and without food and water...the quicker they will realize that this behavoir could get them kicked out of the pack.
Funny thing is...try this behavoir with a cat and it has little effect. Cats have very little instinct for a herd or a pack-mentality. They just sort of think your insane. Cats on the other hand, have an instinct for self-cleaning and staying clean and even hiding their defecation. So for cats all you really need is a box of sand thats very clean (no odor)...their instinct takes over from there.
So I'm saying its instinct, and reaction to action, not guilt, not independent thought your seeing.
Gotta say 3d, your style of potty training a puppy sounds more like animal abuse to me. That is absolutely NOT how to train a dog.
BTW, the mother cat shows the kittens how to use a litter box. It is not and instinctive but learned behaviour.
Gotta say 3d, your style of potty training a puppy sounds more like animal abuse to me. That is absolutely NOT how to train a dog.
BTW, the mother cat shows the kittens how to use a litter box. It is not and instinctive but learned behaviour.
Putting them outside is abuse?
I'm not talking about leaving them at sub zero temps for 24 hrs with no food and water for goodness sakes.
Take a kitten away from her mom and they will still use the litter box. And not all cat moms are the same. I've had cat moms that after 2 weeks basically totally ignore their kittens.
__________________ "We set up this thematic debate between faith and empiricism, basically, in many different iterations of the show, that is what our story has been about"Carlton Cuse (1:00)
Why is Vincent Special?
Hybrid Mode
